Nickel and Dime and the flow of Information (Subscription Concerns)

[Grimhide]

When the crowd sourcing began we were told that as backers we got updates and insider information about the development ect. Then after the goals were met they introduced subscriptions to receive the information that I would argue we should be getting from backing in the first place. It just seems to me that if they need to give us updates(mandated in the crowd sourcing goals) but also need to give subscribers something worth cash every month, then perhaps they are holding out updates that, had there not been a subscription program, all backers would receive. I know many will argue that they wouldn't have the resources to produce these subscriber-only updates without the subscription fees, but where is that line between what would have been available and what subscribers financed? It just seems like paying $30+ for an unfinished game is enough and to holding back info for a subscription fee is milking backers.

I get it, they need money to make this game awesome, but they got that money. We as backers should get the full updates and not be fragmented into first and second class communities. We picked our level of backing based on specific rewards (ships ect) not on how much info we would get about the development process.

[iMik]

When the crowd sourcing began we were told that as backers we got updates and insider information about the development ect. Then after the goals were met they introduced subscriptions to receive the information that I would argue we should be getting from backing in the first place. It just seems to me that if they need to give us updates(mandated in the crowd sourcing goals) but also need to give subscribers something worth cash every month, then perhaps they are holding out updates that, had there not been a subscription program, all backers would receive. I know many will argue that they wouldn't have the resources to produce these subscriber-only updates without the subscription fees, but where is that line between what would have been available and what subscribers financed? It just seems like paying $30+ for an unfinished game is enough and to holding back info for a subscription fee is milking backers.

I get it, they need money to make this game awesome, but they got that money. We as backers should get the full updates and not be fragmented into first and second class communities. We picked our level of backing based on specific rewards (ships ect) not on how much info we would get about the development process.

Some people want to support game after campaigne and CIG made subscription for that. You will be getting updates but those who pay
subscription will get some more, and lot of updates you see as backer will be because of subscribers, so in the end it is win for all of us.

[Watchdog]

Grimhide, let me repost this comment of mine from the comments section of the latest Comm-Link update:

Just a little info about the subscriptions:

In our collective fit of enthusiasm, we had asked for a way to support Star Citizen even after the crowdfunding campaign, with some small monthly payment. As far as I remember, we had not asked for anything in return, just for a way to support the game some more. We were then given the chance to “subscribe”, with the extra money being used to get us some more eye-candy, such as a decal, some exclusive content updates, plus the Imperator subscribers get the 3 answers per year by Chris Roberts and a visit to the company’s HQ and such.

There would have been no Jump Point monthly magazine or any exclusive content updates and such without us asking for the subscriptions in the first place, because anything extra for us costs extra money, even some person’s time spent on typing and formating updates for us. Do not forget that, fellows.

[AndyB]

In addition to what the others have said, much of the artwork etc. content that Subscribers get isn't about what is going into the game but about what didn't make it into the game. It's stuff like the initial rejected concept art for the Constellation MkI and MkII, before the MkIII design was selected and made it into the brochure. Think of it more as seeing stages A, B, C, D and E of a process instead of just C and E - we don't get to see any in-game content that non-subscribers won't get to see eventually, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if items of the final" artwork, audio and models are released to all backers at the same time anyway.

[Rioku]

Can a suscriptor share pictures and other content in a personal web?

Greetings

[RpTheHotrod]

I don't have an issue with Subscribers getting content that did NOT make it into the game, but I do have an issue with going on good faith with a game, spending $250 for it with a lack of information, and being told afterwards "thanks" and then information that is ready to be released being withheld from me unless I spend even more money. I'm hoping that's not the case and that it is indeed just concept art and stuff that didn't make it into the game. If I'm spending money on the game (especially $250+), I'd like to have all the available details of the game that'll effect the product I have purchased. Concept art and such doesn't affect that.

[NetAndy]

I don't have an issue with Subscribers getting content that did NOT make it into the game, but I do have an issue with going on good faith with a game, spending $250 for it with a lack of information, and being told afterwards "thanks" and then information that is ready to be released being withheld from me unless I spend even more money. I'm hoping that's not the case and that it is indeed just concept art and stuff that didn't make it into the game. If I'm spending money on the game (especially $250+), I'd like to have all the available details of the game that'll effect the product I have purchased. Concept art and such doesn't affect that.

You might be surprised how little content there is available for subscribers right now...and we paid $10+ for it, some of much more to get nothing in the previous months There are some great rewards in the Rear Admiral tier and I think that the amount of info what is available for any backer (or anyone at this point) is much much bigger than what is exclusive for subscribers.

[hellenstam]

You will be getting updates but those who pay
subscription will get some more, and lot of updates you see as backer will be because of subscribers, so in the end it is win for all of us.

My favourite part of this first subscriber update was the explanation how the exclusive Subscriber "I.W.I.N." button can be configured to either just blow the opponent up outright or simply power down all their weapons and defenses. It will make it so much easier to shoot out their thrusters and steal their ships.

That and the ten minute video of an Idriss Corvette fighting a Retaliator Bomber... Man, that hangar bay of the Idriss is gonna be a total gamebreaker!

Oh... Right - then the alarm went off and it was time to wake up.

[3lK3busK]

My favourite part of this first subscriber update was the explanation how the exclusive Subscriber "I.W.I.N." button can be configured to either just blow the opponent up outright or simply power down all their weapons and defenses. It will make it so much easier to shoot out their thrusters and steal their ships.

That and the ten minute video of an Idriss Corvette fighting a Retaliator Bomber... Man, that hangar bay of the Idriss is gonna be a total gamebreaker!

Oh... Right - then the alarm went off and it was time to wake up.

You should enclose the whole post within [sarcasm_mode][/sarcasm_mode] tags. Many people won't get it and will think that all that really was in the subscriber update.

Salu2

[Dread-Pirate-Pete]

Backers get 15 updates a month, and subscribers get 17! Oh noes! Gold tickets! Pay to win!

[TraneGibson]

17 Pledge Packages
3 Additional Pledge Package Tiers
17 Digital Add-Ons
7 Physical Add-Ons
4 Subscription types

What else is going to be promised for a game that won't be ready for two more years? With more content continuing to be added and promised, it seems like the community is being nickel and dimed to death to gain access to it. Isn't the total of $7,328,084 (plus additional from outside backers) being raised enough to keep backers informed and supply extras without charging too much for them?

I'm glad that a Comm Link release and Spectrum Dispatch are put out 1 to 1 1/2 times a week but I am upset that there needs to be a paid subscriber service for information. And that for the subscriber service, there's no tier system for pricing that would offer a better prices for longer subscriptions.

I have pledged and I believe in supporting this game but there isn't an incentive for me to purchase any of these items (especially for Jump Point of which I'm very interested in) because they are cost prohibitive with the amount known versus the potential for change. Yes, the skins will change your appearance but will that cause the authorities to stop following you if you're a pirate or will a bounty hunter have difficulties ID'ing your ship if you change the skin? The add-on ship prices are also relatively high despite not receiving additional items like the packaged deals. (I understand there's a problem with adjusting the ship prices versus people who pledged, but make the incentive worthwhile and comp the earlier promotion with something else like credits.)

Example:
Add-on Aurora ship -

• $25.00 USD

Scout-Package $30.00 USD -

• The finished game for your PC with your RSI Aurora spaceship ready to fly.
• Exclusive access to the Alpha and Beta
• 1,000 credits
• White Citizens Card

Of all of the additions, the thing that bugs me most is Jump Point. The community currently receives updates every Friday, sometimes sporadically between, and these updates are the highlight of my week concerning Star Citizen. They are also when I'm most involved (involved in the sense of surfing the forums and gauging reactions). I feel that now I'm being asked to pay for information that I was told I would receive and in turn pay more than what I think they are reasonably worth.

"For the people who pledge for their spaceship in the Star Citizen universe, you’ll be part of a select club that has exclusive access to early gameplay and behind the scenes development updates."

"In addition, part of the money we are asking for is budgeted to maintain the Roberts Space Industries site with constant updates. For those of you that joined before the official announcement on October 10th you’ll know that we’ve been doing two to three updates A DAY. Our goal is for the game’s website to be live from day one, constantly giving information about what’s happening in the galaxy even before the game is live, sharing interesting insights into the development process and canvassing the early backers for their opinions. Roberts Space Industries should be the first stop into the Star Citizen universe. When we say we want to involve the community, we really mean it!"

Why would you make the community pay if you want them involved and want to provide constant information. I can't quantify paying $120.00 a year to be the "first" for details that should filter down to the community that supported it initially. I want to continue to support Star Citizen but adding fees for something that should be included is off base. I could understand making users who pledged log-in in order to view materials and keeping information from forum users who haven't pledge, but asking people who pledged to pay a second time with recurring fees for something that was offered initially doesn't add up.

/rant


Supplemental -

In the table below, I have compared Jump Point to several other publications to highlight the relative cost of subscription to the total page count and frequency of publication. Note that this table does not attribute a cost or value to the multimedia that is also to be provided in the Jump Point package.

The first issue of Jump Point contained 24 pages and included a video. If the monthly cost is $10.00 USD then that would equate to about 42 cents a page (not including the video) for the first issue of Jump Point [10 / 24 = 0.42]. Included in the table are EON Magazine (Eve Online's quarterly publication), Time and Newsweek (weekly news publications), and Wired (a monthly publication covering technology, science, politics, and culture).

	Total Page Count	Cost Per Issue	Cost Per Page	Cost Per Year	Frequency	Notes
Jump Point	24	$10.00 USD	$0.42 USD	$120.00 USD	12	Digital Only
EON Magazine	91	$14.95 USD	$0.16 USD	$59.80 USD	4	Print and Digital
Time Magazine	60	$0.58 USD	$0.01 USD	$30.00 USD	52	Print and Digital
Newsweek	74	$0.46 USD	$0.01 USD	$25.00 USD	54	Digital Only
Wired	294	$1.25 USD	$0.004 USD	$14.95 USD	12	Print and Digital

[reanor]

When the crowd sourcing began we were told that as backers we got updates and insider information about the development ect. Then after the goals were met they introduced subscriptions to receive the information that I would argue we should be getting from backing in the first place. It just seems to me that if they need to give us updates(mandated in the crowd sourcing goals) but also need to give subscribers something worth cash every month, then perhaps they are holding out updates that, had there not been a subscription program, all backers would receive. I know many will argue that they wouldn't have the resources to produce these subscriber-only updates without the subscription fees, but where is that line between what would have been available and what subscribers financed? It just seems like paying $30+ for an unfinished game is enough and to holding back info for a subscription fee is milking backers.

I get it, they need money to make this game awesome, but they got that money. We as backers should get the full updates and not be fragmented into first and second class communities. We picked our level of backing based on specific rewards (ships ect) not on how much info we would get about the development process.

Let the Whining begin...

You ARE getting insider information. Subscribers are getting more. I think there was pretty explanatory explanation from Chris Roberts about the whole thing. You need some special attention from Chris Roberts or something?

[Lasse-B.]

It's what players have asked for, so you can't really blame CIG.

[RRMule]

I don't want to sound like a jerk but I think you are completely off base with your post. This site is literally updated multiple times a week with additional information, in-universe fiction, and occasionally new media from the game. The developers interact with us on a near-daily basis. This is what was initially promised when we were promised regular community updates.

The whole idea of the 'subscription' came when people legitimately made the request of CIG to offer a way for them to support the game with small payments over time because they wanted to contribute but perhaps could not drop $250 or more all at once during the pledge drive. The CIG team thought up a way to provide some value for those additional donations and the subscriber content is what they came up with.

I think people are operating under the mistaken impression that this subscriber content would have been created and shared with everyone if only it weren't for the subscriptions being made available. It was very clearly stated that a portion of that cash raised is being used to produce this additional content. In other words, it would have never been created or shared with the community normally. End of story.

Are the additional tidbits we are getting worth the $10 a month? On a purely value based standpoint they are just a few images and quick videos thus far and a small but pretty digital magazine, so likely not. That is NOT the reason someone should have subscribed and I feel that CIG was very up front in saying more or less "This is for people who want to go above and beyond." These dollars go into making the game.

Odds are everything that is important from subscriber only content WILL make it to you eventually anyway.

[Hermit]

Nope, I'm with you there, OP. Why should I pay for subscription information when, as pledgers, we should get them for nothing. I'd prfer to save the money wasted on Jump Point and put it towards buying another ship.